Yaoi o antiyaoi, esa es la cuestión...[2]

[ariadnem]

I wanted to begin this in Spanish, but I think I better do it in English, I can translate it later on.  Anyways, I've been delaying this for so long now, and I think it's time to do it.

holymegasaint  to me is not a sane person.  Her way to describe people who like yaoi is to say the least...depicable.  She calls us "insane" and even heterophobic.  I wish I could slap her in her face for such a thing.  Oh yes, I have to admit there are fans who can'control themselves and become a pain in everyone's ass, but not everybody is like that.

I respect everyone's point of view, but I believe this girl has crossed the line of my patience and I've lost it.  I'm old enough to be someone's older sister.  I got married almost six years ago, and I love yaoi.  What does it make me, then?  An insane person?  I'm not heterophobic whatsoever.  I love men, I love sex with men (never tried a gal, though). Anyways

I've been ranting about them (antiyaoi people) for months already. It's not that  they're wrong.  They're entitled to like whatever they please; it's the way they express themselves, the way in which they pretend to have all the reason and the right to mistreat others.  That's what makes me angry.  Really angry. it's the same way priests treated people during the Inquisition.  Straight have treated gays for decades.  Men have treated women.  All this to me is, unacceptable.

Again, I accept there are girls who also cross the line in the yaoi world.  We, the people who write yaoi take a character and create for him a setting in which he's in love with another man.  Now, just because we make them homosexual doesn't mean they're damisels in danger, and unfortunately they're portrayed like that.  Most of times.  Not everybody does, though.  That was the first thing my husband told me when he read my first yaoi story ever.  "don't turn then into women, Cone.  They're men, despite their sexual preferences."  he was 100% right.  (he always is)

Now, I have said things like "they should get a life" "they should get laid every now and then." I know what I've said is too...bold and inpudent, but let me explain myself here.  In the yaoi world, we write a lot about sex and explore relationships to a very deep extent.   I wonder if the people who complain so much about yaoi all the time have ever read Toffee's stories, or Animom's or Sagakure's or many other writers who have created good things.  They complain and say yaoi doesn't have a background.  It does. My stories are that...my stories, but they do have a background.  The ones by the people I've mentioned before and by others whose name I can't  recollect at the moment, have a background, one so powerful, we've cried with them, and laughed and said, "they're good".  Also, in yaoi, we explore sex a lot.  Why?  I truly don't have an answer for that and even when in non yaoi fics some people do, they tend to be so lamely written and the woman ends up being so...dunno...Mary Sue???

I  know there are people out there who have written very good non yaoi stories.  One of my favorites, no, my favorite one is "La Batalla de los Doce Tresors" by Altair.  I discovered yaoi first, then this one story, it's wonderful. 

It's non yaoi...what does it make me then?  I like yaoi....non yaoi...what a freaking freak I am.!!!!!  oh God forgive me!!!!!... for liking what I like and for being who I am...btw....thanks for making me that way ^_~

Anyways, I'm enraged with the antiyaoi groups who can't show some respect.  yes, we take characters other people have created and make something different out of it.  It's pretty clear to me that we, the yaoi fans, are a wee bit more respectful than they'd probably ever be.  No, I don't accept rabbid yaoi fangirls, but then again, don't make things general.  I'm mad at the girls who have been around writing all that crap about us, and about yaoi.  I'm mad at the insulting comments they make, so full of anger, frustration and rubbish.

holymegasaint , you asked me at the Saint Seiya Zone Forum to upload some images of yours and your friend shunjune at Labyrinth, my website.  I tried to be polite and answered that you have to keep in mind my web has yaoi content in it.  Well, this is my answer to you.  You are not welcome at my Labyrinth.  Nor is your friend.  Had you shown a different attitude, a more respectful one, things might have been different, but well, that's my answer.  I thought I lived in a century where tolerance was part of our daily lives, but I was wrong.  You and all your friends have proved me how wrong I was.  So, get your antiyaoi groups, life and so and enjoy them greatly .  I wish you the best. I hope you can learn how to write better in both, English and Spanish. I hope your Antiyaoi League works fine.  And that you actually get a f****** life.  I hope you are a happy person one of these days.

And I also hope I can have you as far from me as possible.

I won't hide this post, I'll leave it open for whoever wants to comment, since we, contrary to you, do know what to say and how. 

Comments

[didio.livejournal.com]

I agree with you: everyone has his/her point of view, of course, but that holymegasaint (and company) doesn't seem to respect another guys.

Anyway, I think it is their problem being so absolutely (and absurdly) inmature they can't stand whatever they don't like.

[ariadnem.livejournal.com]

Inmaturity. I remember the AL's impersonator mentioned she was more mature now and that for that reason she didn't like yaoi anymore

[lady-hook.livejournal.com]

and being more mature makes her copycat everyone's else work??? I think her train of thought contradicts itself way too far... XDDD

[ariadnem.livejournal.com]

as if maturity and hating yaoi were the same thing *slaps herself*

[didio.livejournal.com]

She acts like an iconoclast!!!

No arguments... just hate, in an inquisitorial way.

[scorpioyue.livejournal.com]

As you said, it's completely ok to disagree with something, in this case, yaoi. But when the group that disagrees recurs to calling names, I think it's time to go away. There's no way to debate a subject with a fundamentalist mind; there's no way to make them see why they are wrong, because the more you try, the more they get annoyed and lose objectivism. *shakes head*

Anyway, I think there's no need to point out that yaoi fans also enjoy stories about heterosexual couples and thus, we're not heterophobic, etc, etc.

Ah, some people's attitude... *laughs*

[selene-18.livejournal.com]

Well, this proves now those damn anti-yaoi can't just show some f***** respect. I just hate them. And now, BECAUSE of them, I start hating het stuff, because they use it as a damn flag to go around showing off and imposing their absurd point of view.

You know what? I'm not going to let het stuff in "El descanso del guerrero" for a single reason:

Homophobes and prudes like Megacrap, who think we all should write hetero stuff and not yaoi stuff because it's bad, DIE!!! Now I've found another reason not to accept het stuff for "El descanso del guerrero".

Thanks to people like Megacrap!!! Indeed!!!

My words for you, Megacrap: Improve your grammar in both languages and broaden your horizons before someone else stomps over you like a punny ant.

[selene-18.livejournal.com]

Wanna laugh? Check this:

Yo me les uno ya me que canse que siempre digan que mi amado Camus es Gay y lo ponga de pareja con otros, eso no me gusta asi que cuentan con mi apoyo para borrar el Yaoi ;D

Isn't she idiot? Thinking they can delete yaoi... Hah... Damn lamers....

[luxshine.livejournal.com]

I can delete yaoi. It's really simple, actually. There's this nifty button in my computer that says 'delete' and if I write yaoi, I can delete it. Or delete the files from my computer. Amazing that this girls need help finding the button. Or maybe their computers do not have a 'delete' button.

Seriously, my personal position is 'don't like, don't read'. I love yaoi practically everywhere, but in some fandoms I can't stand it. So, I don't look for yaoi fics in those fandoms. Plus, I understand the difference between canon and fanon, something this girls don't seem to grasp. Canon isn't gay, sure. He isn't straight either. Why? Because Kurumada was a bit busy showing us that he would die for his beliefs and didn't deem important to tell us what side of the sex mambo does the icicle prefers.

[selene-18.livejournal.com]

So damn right, Luxshine.

Instead of starting calling us names, saying bullshit, and building silly "anti-yaoi" leagues, why don't they stick to their "straight" fandom?

Would they like us to build a club for Anti-Yaoi's haters? Would they love to have an Anti-Hetero league?

I'd do it, but I prefer to stick up with my gays couples, and to hell with those who don't like it. All we ask is to be off alone with our tastes!

Actually, I don't care if this girl hates yaoi. But thinking she can delete yaoi from the fandom... So damn delicious, utterly and blatantly idiot.

As for me... There's a lot of anti-yaois that can't even think well. Oh no matter... More ridiculous ones for us to laugh at.

[luxshine.livejournal.com]

Well, there's an anti-anti-yaoi com, if I recall correctly. And there are some pro-yaoi fangirls that make me groan because they're as stupid as the anti-yaoi faction.

Thankfully, we're the sane ones away from all that kerfuffle.

[ariadnem.livejournal.com]

You're 100% right. We're still sane people. I don't intend to create anything against them...yet. I'm tempted...too tempted to do that, actually. But I won't fall as down as they had already. Ijust needed to take that antoyaoi shite out of my system...and it feels really good.

Now, this "character" doesn't learn, you know? she took a friend´s from the Spanish fandom fic and posted it on her Lj and didn't even credit. She just posted the link to ffiction and then the actual fic; our friend's profile is there and she said she didn't know the authoress ( zelha ). Today, Msaint delete the fic and kept the link but still doesn't credit her....¬¬

[selene-18.livejournal.com]

Really? Well, best for us to remain together and enjoy yaoi peacefully. However, should anti-yaoi come here and bug us, we shall attack too.

[ariadnelabys.livejournal.com]

She better doesn't come around my Labrys...I'll unleash the Minotaur if she dares....

[selene-18.livejournal.com]

She MIGHT do it... We'll never know, so we keep tridents, minotaurs and all the weaponry ready xD

[ariadnem.livejournal.com]

Poor her...muajajaajajajajajajja

[selene-18.livejournal.com]

I know xD and poor ALL YOU ANTI-YAOI who dare enter in our Yaoi world!

[ariadnem.livejournal.com]

I wish they could learn to be a wee bit more respectful. I personally don't need everyone to agree with me, yet these ladies have gone far beyond.

I think they have no idea what they are saying and their arguments are more than simply lame.

[selene-18.livejournal.com]

Naah you're asking them too much!!! They don't know the word respect, yet they cry when they're flamed or facing something they don't like! ¬¬

[shadow-arashi.livejournal.com]

I found out about this whole mess through my friend Selene18 and your lj and I'm still amazed it got so far.

This person needs to calm down, honestly. Personally I'm all about "live and let live". If you don't like something, don't read it. I don't like reading fics with my favorite character paired up with a girl, fine. I don't read any of those fics and I don't go out of my way to diss the person who write it in the first place. *shakes head*

Still what rubs me even more in the wrong way is the way this person has the audacy to then ask you to post her stuff on your site.

Now on another part of your post: I just realise I should be more careful in the way I write my own fics. O.O I'm scared I wrote my characters sometimes in a not "manly" enough way. *shudders as she realises she will need to reread her story to make sure*

[ariadnem.livejournal.com]

she's very audacious, isn't she?? too bad for her, I won't do that. Now, they call us (people who like yaoi) names...I should start to think on one that might fit them, jejejejeje.

I'm glad some of what you said has got you to think about your writing in a positive way ^^

[selene-18.livejournal.com]

Well, their scientific names ares homophobes and narrow-minded prudes =P any other you would suggest?

[ariadnem.livejournal.com]

better shut my mouth....'ve been cursing too much lately

[selene-18.livejournal.com]

Go on! ]=) CURSE! That'll make you feel a lot better!

[torquemadman.livejournal.com]

My guess is that our megasaint is actually yaoi fan in denial. >:-) After all, she rabidly follows yaoi writers, reads their stuff and otherwise seems very well informed what happens in yaoi part of fandom -- and when something seriously grosses you out, you don't seek that. Now, morbid fascination + isuess, that's a whole 'nother thing... ;)
She doesn't anger me that much, rather amuses. Now, the actually smart and cunning hater, that would worry me.

Also, followed your link. My, that's some abysmal art. Even I can draw better, and I know I can't draw.

[ariadnem.livejournal.com]

You might have a point...all the attacks and tantrums...I agree with you. Today, after a couple of days, she amuses me too. I was really pissed off at first, now...anyways, I still think something must be done. In the Spanish Fandom, she keeps posting things like "the return to innocence" translation as her own. And even posts fics from other people on her lj but doesn't credit.

[selene-18.livejournal.com]

Ohhhh you're right ]=) what a nice way to say it, lopt!

[lady-hook.livejournal.com]

*still amazed* I've known about all this issue thanks to bookworm_e's lj and then I got into reading the comments and posts of the people around the comm...but never could imagine that she actually asked you to post her stuff at your labyrinth when she's so against yaoi and so intolerant with it (and when you write about it)...I cannot understand why there are around people still so close in their minds as not to accept that there are different possibilities in life...If they think we, people who love yaoi are sick in the mind 'cos we love "unnatural" things (what's "natural" after all? just what has been imposed by the majority or what some lame ones think is the norm we have all to follow??) they should ckeck what's the norm for them and how they have arrived to that...I love the things I find appealing and seriously, the fics I've found with yaoi content I love them 'cos they are well-written and they touch my feelings...and I also love what they think it's "normal" (as long as the fics are well-written and the fanart is impressive good and makes me feel like "damn,this is great!" and of course I find guys much sexy and appealing,and like you I find myself then wondering: heck,what a bizarre thing am I for these crusaders of the "natural" thing!!!
yeah,you're totally right,they're not much different from the witch-craze or red-hunt...and it seemed we were in a new century of light and understanding...
Hope I shock her and all her league with my fanarts XDDDD!!
*blinks* delete yaoi from the net??? uh?????

[selene-18.livejournal.com]

Indeed Lady Hook.

This little girl thinks she can delete yaoi from the net ^^ isn't she idiot?

[lady-hook.livejournal.com]

truly indeed!!
She seems to forget that since Biblical times (and even before that) homosexuality was there and is still here...Intolerance and disrespect prove nothing when there's really something as deep as love, and the forms of that love (being yaoi, "straight" or...whatever!) will be around no matter how many pretend to erase that... Besides, internet is such a huge space for thoughts,posts,comments,fanarts... that no matter how many enroll themselves in her team it'll prove a very difficult and unattainable task...If the poor girl is reading this (nothing against her,really,only that people must have respect for others no matter their tastes/opinions) the best option for her or others the like to her,I think, should be not to read yaoi if yaoi is not their cup of tea... and stop the nonsense of insulting others.

[selene-18.livejournal.com]

Indeed. It would be interesting to see them trying and trying, and just seeing yaoi communities are getting bigger and bigger each day, even as we speak.

So that's it. Instead of saying "I'll delete yaoi because my Camus is manly" I'd say "Then, if I don't like yaoi, so I'll stick to my manly and straight Camus".

Simple, ain't it? Saves energy, time, effort and gives pretty much more satisfaction. And to us, we will say "wow, she/he doesn't like yaoi... But she respects us... So we will respect too".

Hell I wish the damn buggers would think that way.

[ariadnem.livejournal.com]

That's my point precisely: RESPECT. Something the antiyaoi doesn't seem to know.

Now...delete yaoi....JAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAJAAJJA

Y déjenme seguirme riendo de semejante idiotez

[selene-18.livejournal.com]

I don't know any anti-yaoi that knows the word respect -_- most of them are loud, rude, ignorant.

Poor little things... They deserve to be locked in a small, glass cage without being able to move...

[ariadnem.livejournal.com]

Amén!!!!!!

[selene-18.livejournal.com]

As we pray in Spanish "Por los siglos de los siglos" Jojojo >D